Liberation Psychology: Addressing the Wounds of Racism

June 01, 2023

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YCSC Grand Rounds May 30, 2023

Thema Bryant, PhD, President, American Psychological Association

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00:03Great. Well, good afternoon again everyone
00:05and welcome to a very special Grand Rounds.
00:09So this Grand Rounds is hosted
00:11by our psychology Fellows.
00:13This is our second in our series
00:14of our trainee takeovers.
00:16So thank you very much for joining us both
00:19here in the Cohen Auditorium and remotely.
00:22And and just a reminder
00:25about Grand Rounds next week,
00:27we will have talks from our T32.
00:30Trainees, So we'll hear from Alan Gerber,
00:32Peter Castagna and friends,
00:34and Jessica Penner.
00:35So please do join us for
00:38those three talks next week.
00:40And with no further ado,
00:42I will pass you over to Kara and
00:45Danny to host Brand Ryan's for today.
00:52Hello. All right, so we will start out
00:54just by briefly introducing ourselves.
00:56So my name is Kara Tomasso.
00:58I am the first year soon to be second year.
01:01I'm pediatric psychology fellow
01:03and I'm Danny Novick and I too am
01:07the first soon to be second year
01:09fellow in the early childhood track.
01:13Good to see everyone,
01:14and we are absolutely thrilled to
01:16introduce today's Grand Round speaker,
01:18Doctor Tama Bryant.
01:19When we and the other fellows were
01:21talking about who we'd like to invite,
01:24we knew we wanted someone whose
01:26clinical practice and research would
01:27have implications for our own work
01:29aimed at improving the lives of
01:31the children and families who come
01:32to the Yale Child Study Center.
01:34And Doctor Bryant goes above
01:36and beyond this criterion.
01:38You know,
01:39her work and lived experiences cut to
01:41the core of many of the challenges
01:43that the children and families
01:44we serve are up against sexism,
01:46racism, trauma,
01:47and grief.
01:47But perhaps what is most beautiful
01:50about Doctor Bryant's work is that
01:52the common thread across her many,
01:54many accomplishments is her focus
01:56on advocacy,
01:57improving accessibility to
01:59mental health resources,
02:00decolonizing psychology as a discipline
02:02in keeping humanity and her core
02:05values at the heart of it all.
02:07Doctor Bryant is a professor
02:09of psychology and the Graduate
02:10School of Education and Psychology
02:12at Pepperdine University,
02:14where she leads the Culture
02:16and Trauma Research Laboratory.
02:17She's the past president of the
02:19Society for the Psychology of Women
02:21and the current president of the
02:23American Psychological Association,
02:25and it's even found time.
02:26It's sometime in there to earn a
02:28master's of divinity and become
02:29an ordained minister.
02:30To list all of her athletes
02:32would take the full grand rounds,
02:34and then them.
02:35She is one of the foremost experts
02:37on the trauma of racism and she's
02:39edited an APA book for clinicians
02:42called Multicultural Feminist Therapy
02:44Helping Adolescent Girls of Color to Thrive,
02:46which presents a strength spaced,
02:48multicultural feminist lens to guide
02:50work with black and brown teenage girls.
02:53She's also the host of the mental
02:55health podcast Homecoming and
02:57author of the book Homecoming
02:59Overcome Fear and Trauma to Reclaim
03:01Your Whole Authentic Self.
03:02And coauthor of The Anti Racism Handbook,
03:05practical tools to shift your mindset and
03:07uproot racism in your life and community.
03:10We are so very grateful for
03:12your willingness to share your
03:13knowledge with us today, Dr.
03:14Brian.
03:15So please join us in giving a
03:17warm welcome to Dr.
03:18Brian as she presents on liberation
03:20psychology and addressing
03:21the wounds of racism.
03:24Thank you so much.
03:26I am so grateful to be with you all.
03:30And I come to you with a very,
03:32very full heart.
03:33Often when we think about
03:36racism and addressing racism,
03:38the initial emotional response
03:41for many people is anxiety
03:44or dread or anger or despair.
03:47And I want you to know that working to
03:51combat racism is driven by a great,
03:54great sense of love.
03:56A great sense of love and
03:58compassion for us to do this labor,
04:01where there is space and room
04:03for us to not only survive,
04:05but to grow and to flourish.
04:09And many times this is a
04:11topic that is avoided.
04:13And so I am so appreciative for
04:16your students and faculty for
04:19intentionally making space for
04:22us to collectively look at our.
04:26Intentional work to dismantle and
04:28disrupt racism and other forms of
04:32oppression and all of their forms in
04:34the lives of children and families.
04:37And many times we are waiting for
04:40and expecting someone else to do it.
04:42And I want to say in the words of
04:45sweet honey in the rock, we are the ones.
04:49We are the ones we've been waiting for.
04:54We are the ones. We are the ones.
04:58We are the ones we've been waiting for.
05:02And my 4 parents of the Civil Rights
05:06movement would say if not us,
05:09who If not now, when? If not us, who?
05:12If not now, when?
05:14So it is not for someone else to do.
05:17Many before us have been doing this work.
05:20And so we honor them, celebrate them,
05:22and make a commitment that we
05:24will not drop the baton,
05:26but we will not look for
05:28somebody else to run our lap.
05:30But each of us has a responsibility to
05:33do this work. So I will share my screen.
05:47So we are thinking about healing the
05:50wounds of racism approaching and
05:53integrating liberation psychology.
05:56My pronouns are she, her, and hers.
05:58I am a woman of African descent.
06:01As you heard,
06:02I'm a psychologist and a minister.
06:04But I'm also relational, mother,
06:06daughter, sister, partner,
06:07friends, scholar, learner.
06:09And I invite you and the students
06:12to resist colonized notions
06:14that say that to be professional
06:17we have to erase ourselves.
06:19And I tell my students at Pepperdine,
06:22if you get to the point of commencement
06:24and you have left yourself behind,
06:27we have robbed you.
06:28There is no point in having a diverse
06:31field if everyone believes they
06:32have to be clone of each other,
06:35but instead for us to intentionally
06:37show up in the fullness and
06:40richness of our various identities.
06:43I am coming to you from the land
06:45that's been cultivated by the Tonga
06:47peoples and other indigenous peoples.
06:49I encourage you to identify,
06:52discover, acknowledge,
06:53appreciate those who cultivated the
06:55land on which you work and gather.
06:58Not only as a matter of history,
07:00but also to become aware of their
07:03vibrant cultures in the present,
07:05their challenges and contributions.
07:07We are more familiar with land recognition,
07:10but a labor recognition is also important.
07:13We want to be mindful that the
07:16United States is a relatively large,
07:18relatively short lived nation.
07:20And yet it has developed at an
07:24accelerated pace and a big part of that
07:27development was based on exploited labor,
07:30largely the labor historically
07:32of people of African descent.
07:35And we recognize that there continues
07:37to be exploited labor to today.
07:39And so we do not want to erase that reality.
07:43I want to also name that we are
07:45gathering at a time where the socio
07:48political climate has much hostility,
07:50instability and overt violence.
07:52We are dealing with the echoes of Pandemic,
07:56and I am aware that in each of
07:58these boxes there is a story.
08:00And so even though you provide
08:02care for others,
08:04I want you to know that we
08:06ourselves are worthy of care.
08:08And I recognize that each of us
08:10have visible and invisible losses.
08:12And so I invite you to take a moment
08:15of inhaling in through your nose
08:19and exhaling out through the mouth.
08:24I also want to say that as we
08:26are seeking to address racism,
08:28many universities are comfortable
08:30as long as we are talking about
08:33helping people cope with racism that
08:35is happening somewhere out there.
08:38If we're talking about children
08:40seeing school shootings or students
08:43witnessing police brutality,
08:44there can be a certain level of openness.
08:50But when students and others
08:52begin to talk about oppression
08:55and racism in particular within
08:57our field or within our campus,
09:00people often get uncomfortable and will
09:03label them troublemakers or say that
09:06they are always complaining and we
09:09have to be willing to see the wounds
09:11in all of the places they show up.
09:14Which include in your department?
09:17Which include in your curriculum,
09:19which include in your clinics.
09:22And I want to say to you,
09:24as a feminist psychologist,
09:26a womanist psychologist,
09:28I resist and reject the myth of neutrality.
09:32So some people pretend that they're neutral
09:34and that everybody else has a worldview,
09:37and I don't think you can
09:39get more colonized than that,
09:40than to believe the way you see the world.
09:43Is simply truth and everybody else is
09:46coming from a slanted perspective.
09:49So it is important for us all to
09:52recognize that we show up to this
09:55work with a lived reality and also an
09:59intergenerational reality, and so that truth.
10:02Is not the problem.
10:04It is the lack of awareness and
10:07acknowledgement of that which is problematic.
10:09And so each of us,
10:11when we look at what we research,
10:13when we look at the ways in
10:15which we practice,
10:16those have been formed as a
10:19result of our socialization,
10:20not just our professional lens,
10:24but our lived experience.
10:27And that is an important place of launching.
10:32So I am a lover of words and proverbs,
10:36Lucille Clifton,
10:37an African American poet,
10:39wrote Come and celebrate with
10:42me that every day something has
10:45tried to kill me and has failed.
10:48And there's a Mexican proverb
10:50which says they tried to bury us.
10:52They didn't know we were seeds.
10:54So these two proverbs are really
10:57a reminder for us to hold both
11:00the realities of racial trauma.
11:03As well as stories of triumph,
11:06of overcoming A flourishing.
11:07So we do not want to come away from
11:11this conversation with a notion
11:13of pity and that these are people
11:16who need to be rescued,
11:17but instead from a place of acknowledging
11:20the wounds and the strengths,
11:23the contributions,
11:24the clarity and the distress.
11:28That we want to see each other
11:31in our full humanity,
11:32which will then put us in a position
11:35to work collaboratively instead of
11:37adopting A Messiah complex where
11:39we believe we know what is best
11:41for other people
11:48and it doesn't. There we go.
11:51So one of the things that we want
11:53to be able to acknowledge is the
11:56realities of racial stress and trauma.
11:58Audrey Lorde wrote This woman is black,
12:01so her blood is shed in silence.
12:03So you want to think about what are
12:07the traumas that you have learned
12:09about as traumas and what are the
12:12traumas that you have difficulty or
12:15push back in acknowledging our traumas.
12:18So the notion of PTSD was developed
12:22thinking about veterans and we
12:24consider post traumatic stress disorder
12:26that they came home from battle.
12:28And then it was a part of our
12:31work to help them to recover.
12:33And then there was push back
12:34in the field to say, well,
12:35wait a minute, what about molestation?
12:37What about intimate partner violence?
12:40And at first people said,
12:41well, they didn't go to war.
12:42That doesn't count.
12:43And then the case was made that some
12:46People's War was in their childhood bedrooms,
12:48some were on school yards,
12:50some were in alleyways.
12:52And so there was a broadening of our
12:55understanding of what comprised trauma.
12:58So there has been a push in the
13:01field for the acknowledgement of
13:04what is called societal trauma,
13:07or some call it intergenerational
13:09or historical trauma,
13:10or race based or racism based trauma,
13:14as well as other forms of
13:17oppression that sexism.
13:18And sexual trauma can be traumatizing
13:22as well as the forms of oppression
13:26when we think of heterosexism,
13:29classism, ableism, ageism.
13:31And there have been those in the field,
13:37trauma experts in the field,
13:40who have sought to deny this reality.
13:43And so you want to ask yourself what and who?
13:48Benefits from the discipline
13:51silence on racial trauma.
13:53And I have had people say things like,
13:56well, intimate partner violence
13:58is a capital T trauma,
14:00but racial trauma would be a lower
14:02case T trauma because it is,
14:04quote,
14:05just emotional abuse.
14:08And anyone who thinks that racism
14:11is just emotional abuse has
14:13not been paying attention.
14:15So when we talk about the threat
14:18to people's very lives and safety,
14:20it is important to recognize that racism
14:24is not just a mere matter of bias.
14:27We get very comfortable with the word bias,
14:29and people prefer you use the word bias
14:32than racism because it sounds very soft.
14:35It's very palatable.
14:36It is very acceptable that we
14:39all have biases but people?
14:41Become hesitant to use the word
14:44racism unless it is a Klan member.
14:47And then even at that point they will
14:50question the use of the terminology racism.
14:53I want to say in our work for the
14:56American Psychological Association
14:58that we recognize that racism
15:00is not only interpersonal,
15:02that it is systemic, it is structural,
15:05It is institutionalized.
15:08Racism is unavoidable.
15:10So if it was only a matter
15:13of individual biases,
15:14then we could tell children and
15:16families who know that someone
15:18is racist to just avoid them.
15:21If you have someone on your street who
15:23doesn't like black or brown people,
15:25or doesn't like Asian people,
15:27just stay out of their yard, right?
15:29It sounds like a simple solution.
15:31But when we recognize that,
15:33not by a matter of opinion but by
15:37documented science, that racism
15:39shows up in the educational system,
15:41that it shows up in the healthcare system,
15:44that it shows up in the criminal
15:46justice system, that it shows up
15:48in the banking and loan system,
15:49that it shows up in the application
15:52process for jobs and for colleges, then we.
15:55Understand that to apply our
15:58science ethically does not mean
16:01just teaching people to ignore it.
16:04Whereas some people will say
16:05you all talk about it too much,
16:06maybe if you didn't talk about it,
16:08it wouldn't be a problem,
16:09and it is that silencing denial and
16:14erasure which multiplies the issue.
16:17We understand from the work of
16:20Judith Herman that perpetrators
16:22only require our silence.
16:25Silence protects what is in power.
16:28Silence protects the status quo.
16:31Silence protects what already is.
16:33And so we have to lean into the discomfort
16:36of being able to address racism.
16:39Some people will say,
16:40well,
16:40they don't want to bring this
16:42topic up with children because
16:44they don't want to upset them.
16:47So the lack of socialization,
16:49the lack of preparation.
16:51The lack of acknowledgement is a set
16:54up for children to feel the shame
16:57and self blame of their individual
17:00selves instead of recognizing what is
17:03happening within them and around them
17:06on a structural and systemic level,
17:09and also to be able to empower
17:12and encourage our families
17:13to proactively address it.
17:16And to teach our children not just
17:19about racism but racial identity.
17:22So that your introduction to it is
17:25not just that some people may not
17:28like me because of my identity,
17:30but it is also for them to recognize
17:34the gifts and the history and the
17:37legacy that comes with their heritage.
17:40And so some people will say,
17:42well, this makes sense.
17:44If your client is already really
17:47immersed in their culture,
17:48but if,
17:49for example,
17:50they had intercultural adoption
17:52or international adoption,
17:54or they did not grow up being
17:56familiar with it,
17:57then that perhaps we should not say anything.
18:00And I appreciate the work of Doctor
18:02Manuel and the Chicano Affirmative
18:05Psychotherapy Institute who says if a
18:08client has never heard of mindfulness.
18:10We don't say I'm not going to mention
18:13it to them because it's not already
18:15an understanding that they have.
18:17Likewise,
18:18if someone does not already know
18:21their culture and cultural identity,
18:24it doesn't make sense to say,
18:25well,
18:25I'm not going to mention it when
18:28we consider what are the protected
18:30factors and the tools that help people
18:33to not only survive but thrive.
18:35As we think about racism,
18:37it's important to know there is the
18:40historical and intergenerational piece
18:42as well as the contemporary reality.
18:44And so in terms of the historical piece,
18:46you want to consider the transmission
18:49of trauma across the generations.
18:52So trauma is documented to
18:54shift our nervous systems
18:56and then those shifts can be passed
18:58down to the next generation.
19:00The good news is we recognize
19:02that healing can also shift the
19:05nervous system and can also be
19:07passed down to the next generation.
19:09You want to consider,
19:10as we talk about racism,
19:12both what it means to be a primary target,
19:15what it also means to bear witness,
19:18and the impact of that
19:19on the lives of children,
19:21as well as vicarious traumatization.
19:24So even if they did not know
19:26the people personally.
19:27What is the impact of seeing on
19:29the news or in the community
19:32people of your shared identity,
19:34Being dehumanized, brutalized,
19:36and then a lack of justice?
19:39When we were having the surge
19:41of hate towards Asian Americans,
19:43hate crimes a number of my Asian
19:46American students talked about,
19:48even if they had not been directly targeted,
19:52that feeling of anxiety and
19:54dread and worry as they were.
19:57Concerned for members of their community
20:00and in particular their elders at
20:02that time and in an ongoing way.
20:04So it is not just about have the
20:06children you worked with in a way
20:09that is that they are conscious
20:10about been directly targeted.
20:13But what is the impact of these
20:16experiences that are pervasive
20:18in our communities?
20:21So the wounds of racial stress and
20:23trauma are important to acknowledge.
20:26Emotionally,
20:26people may show up with depression
20:28and I want to raise to your awareness
20:32irritable depression and for you
20:34to consider the stereotype of
20:37black women with a bad attitude.
20:40And so yes,
20:41we all can enjoy clients who come
20:43in with big smiles and gratitude
20:46and quickly saying that they have
20:48all these aha moments,
20:50but I want to really encourage
20:53your compassion.
20:54For the family members who
20:56show up with arms crossed,
20:57with legs crossed,
20:59keeping their coat buttoned up,
21:01keep keeping their purse and their lap and
21:04giving you what we would call a side eye,
21:07that we recognize.
21:08That from people's lived experience,
21:10it's not that they have trust issues,
21:13it is that systems have been
21:15untrustworthy and so it is not
21:18just to see them as the problem.
21:21But from liberation psychology,
21:23we understand the importance
21:25of problematization,
21:26where we actually recognize what
21:28is the root of what we are seeing
21:31in the present.
21:32So the irritability you want
21:34to attend to anxiety, anger.
21:36And many of us who are in the field
21:40have an issue with people's anger
21:42and we are quick to pathologize
21:44it and try to squash it.
21:47And I want to say to you,
21:48it is healthy for people to be
21:51outraged about outrageous things.
21:53Outrageous things have happened.
21:55And so we want to check ourselves in,
21:59our own healing about our issues
22:03and discomfort,
22:04sitting with people's outrage,
22:06and also what we have been taught
22:09about people of color.
22:12So I want you to think about your
22:15emotional response if,
22:16for example,
22:16you see a white woman who is
22:19angry versus your emotional
22:21response if a black or brown man
22:24is angry. And so we often we also
22:27see that with our adolescence and
22:31the ways in which anger and other
22:34emotional responses get racialized
22:36in terms of who is seen as a threat.
22:39And who is seen as a human
22:42being having a human response?
22:45We also consider substance dependence,
22:48suicidal thoughts, fatigue, dissociation.
22:50We want to also be mindful
22:53of the somatic complaints,
22:56where many may say it doesn't
22:57bother me but I have backache.
23:00It doesn't bother me, but I'm nauseous.
23:02It doesn't bother me, but I have
23:05migraines we want to consider difficult.
23:08Be concentrating, remembering and focusing,
23:10especially as we think about children
23:12and how they are doing in school.
23:14And this expectation for business as usual,
23:19that while there can be police
23:21brutality in your community,
23:23you are to show up the next day at school.
23:26No one speaks about it, no one names it,
23:29and you are expected to perform.
23:31And we want to think about the
23:33ways in which that is dehumanizing.
23:35Not only within the school systems,
23:37but also within our practices when we
23:41claim that we are doing a full assessment
23:44to find out about the stressors in
23:47our children's and families lives
23:49and we never ask about experiences
23:52of discrimination or bias or racism.
23:57Racism also creates barriers,
24:00barriers to educational possibility,
24:03economics and political resources.
24:05And when we talk about these barriers,
24:09some people again get uncomfortable
24:12because to name the barriers is to some
24:17people feel erase the ways in which
24:20people who are white have worked hard.
24:24And I want you to acknowledge that both
24:27things can exist on an individual level.
24:30People may have worked very hard and we
24:33are not dealing with a level playing field.
24:36And there are additional barriers
24:39that are put in front of some
24:43communities and families.
24:44Racism also has physical health consequences.
24:48Increased risk of injury, infection, asthma,
24:52cardiovascular disease initially with COVID.
24:56More losses once the vaccination came out.
24:59There were more people of color percentage
25:01wise who were getting vaccinated.
25:03Birthing complications.
25:04We have how I say we African American
25:08women have higher risk of mortality,
25:12death during pregnancy, maternal mortality.
25:16And then another piece we often don't
25:19address are the spiritual consequences.
25:21Many of our programs,
25:23when they talk about cultural competence,
25:26will only talk about race and ethnicity,
25:29maybe gender and sexuality,
25:31maybe talk about disability.
25:34But there has been a persistent erasure
25:39or pathologizing around spirituality.
25:43People of color and women endorse
25:47higher spirituality.
25:48And So what does it mean as a
25:51field for us to erase meaning,
25:53making and coping and understanding
25:56in these ways?
25:58And so it was in, I think,
26:01in my postdoctoral training the
26:04first time I heard this phrase,
26:07hyper religiosity.
26:08And as a pastor's daughter,
26:10I was definitely like,
26:12what is that?
26:13And I became clear very quickly
26:15that it was very subjective based
26:18on people's lived experience.
26:20So if someone grew up with no
26:23spirituality or religiosity,
26:24and they have a client who
26:26attends services twice a week,
26:28it will label them hyperreligious.
26:31Or there was a black mother who needed
26:33to make a decision about her son,
26:35and she told the therapist,
26:38I need to pray about it.
26:39I'll let you know next week.
26:41And he thought that was the most
26:43ridiculous thing he ever heard.
26:45So we want to be mindful and
26:49intentional about integrating and
26:51preparing our students and ourselves.
26:54Because of course,
26:55you cannot prepare others with you
26:57with what you are not prepared for.
26:59So we also have to educate ourselves about
27:02how to ethically and appropriately address,
27:05acknowledge, integrate people's
27:08spirituality and religious.
27:11Beliefs and practices.
27:12And that can start even simply within our our
27:17assessment process of asking the question.
27:20If you have a family for whom
27:22spirituality and religion is central
27:24and you have never spoken about it,
27:27that you don't actually know that family,
27:30You don't actually know them.
27:31If it's central to them
27:33and you don't know that,
27:35then you know a fraction of them.
27:37And so we want to be mindful of that,
27:40and I want to name around spirituality
27:42and religiosity that we have
27:44to be able to hold both ends,
27:47which is for some people it has
27:49been a major source of strength and
27:53resilience and meaning and coping.
27:56And for some people it has been a
27:58site of harm, of abuse, of rejection.
28:01And if we're not willing to
28:03acknowledge both of those things exist.
28:06Then we're missing it.
28:07So some of us who may be spiritual
28:10or religious are not willing to
28:12acknowledge harms that have been done,
28:14and some people who are tuned
28:16into the harms are unwilling to
28:18see the ways in which it could be
28:21beneficial or helpful to anyone.
28:24And those end up resulting in us not
28:31seeing people fully so in terms of the
28:34effects with racial stress and trauma.
28:36Many people who have worked to combat
28:39racism have been people of faith.
28:41And we can think about that in
28:44terms of needing to be able to see
28:46what is possible beyond what is,
28:48and trying to have some sense of hope or
28:51faith in the fact that things can get better.
28:54And at the same time,
28:57we want to think about,
28:58for some people,
28:59utilizing their religious coping,
29:01so gathering with their community,
29:04reading sacred texts.
29:05Prayer and we also want to think about
29:08for some how it may intensify notions
29:11of shame and stigma and self blame.
29:14So for example,
29:16sexual assault of young people if
29:18they believe that God is mad at them,
29:20or that now they are less because
29:22they are not a virgin or any.
29:24Or this pressure to instantly forgive.
29:28So we have to look at the nuance
29:31and the layers in order to support
29:33people in a holistic way.
29:35So as you are seeing the effects
29:38for children and for their families,
29:41you want to consider for yourself
29:44how you are responding to what
29:47they are showing you,
29:48whether there is compassion or judgment,
29:51whether there is the expectation
29:54for super strength or if we
29:57also recognize the the need.
30:00For a saving face or for honor means
30:04that many people of color may not
30:08come in visually falling apart.
30:10And because they are not putting
30:13their distress on display,
30:15sometimes we are quick to terminate them,
30:18Sometimes we are quick to say that they're
30:21not ready for change because of the
30:24ways in which they hold their distress.
30:27So if I hold it physically and spiritually,
30:30will you respond with the same compassion
30:32as someone who was sitting there in tears?
30:38So there are barriers that have kept us from
30:41engaging around racism and addressing it.
30:44For some it is denial.
30:46So the belief that either it doesn't
30:48exist or it's not that big a deal
30:51that it doesn't happen that much.
30:53And so if you are in denial,
30:54then you're going to say
30:56we shouldn't talk about it.
30:57And I I want to say with assessment,
31:01when we ask people about other issues,
31:04if it is not a personal concern of theirs,
31:07we don't think we did something
31:09wrong by asking, right?
31:10But as soon as we talk
31:12about sexism or racism,
31:13if we ask and people don't grab hold of it,
31:17then people will say, oh,
31:18I knew I shouldn't have asked about it.
31:20I'll never ask about it again.
31:22When we ask about substance
31:24use and people deny it,
31:25or when we ask about relationship
31:29abuse and people say no,
31:31that's not their experience,
31:32we don't then take it off the table.
31:35There are also mental health providers
31:37who minimize or who victim blame,
31:40and this is a key one.
31:41When you hear cases of police brutality,
31:44if your first response is,
31:47well, why did they run?
31:49For your first response in terms of the
31:52man who was killed on the subway train,
31:55if your response was, well,
31:57he was being loud,
31:59right?
31:59If you're If you are justifying the
32:02harms that have been done to people,
32:05it is going to be near impossible
32:08for you to be helpful ethically to
32:11clients who've experienced racism.
32:14There are others who are
32:16immobilized by guilt and fear.
32:19So you may feel like this is real and
32:22that it exists and it's problematic,
32:24but I'm afraid of saying the wrong
32:26thing or doing the wrong thing.
32:28So I will say nothing.
32:30And it is very important for us
32:31to lean into the discomfort,
32:33recognizing that when we're learning,
32:36we're going to make mistakes.
32:38The key is to acknowledge it and
32:40if there are ruptures with your
32:42client to be able to acknowledge it,
32:44apologize and learn from it
32:46and as we move forward.
32:48So the example that I like to give
32:51as a straight woman who seeks
32:53to be an ally or an accomplice
32:56with the L GB TQ community,
32:58that if someone tells me I said
33:01something wrong or did something wrong,
33:04it would be so problematic.
33:06If I said something like, well,
33:07at least I tried and you all
33:09didn't acknowledge that I tried,
33:10so I'm not going to try anymore,
33:12right?
33:13That would be very emotionally immature.
33:15And so the same is true when we
33:19think about addressing racism
33:20and other forms of oppression as
33:23opposed to being immobilized by
33:26the fear of imperfection.
33:28To acknowledge we're going to be
33:30imperfect and we want to grow from it,
33:32right?
33:34The bystander effect,
33:35where many people in the field
33:37will leave the full weight of
33:40this responsibility on the staff
33:42and faculty of color.
33:43So they can have invisible
33:45labor where it is on
33:48them to address these issues and
33:50no one else is taking their part
33:54instead of recognizing that this
33:56is a collective issue and it
34:00requires A collective effort and
34:03prioritization for us to shift the tide.
34:06Fragility is another one.
34:07So a couple of years ago you may
34:10have known one of the number one
34:12books on Amazon was a book called
34:14White Fragility and some people get
34:17offended just even by the title.
34:19But it is important when we
34:22think about fragility,
34:23it is this idea that one I cannot
34:26hear other people's emotional pain.
34:29So when people are sharing their distress,
34:32if I say.
34:33I don't feel emotionally
34:35safe hearing their distress.
34:37So now all of the attention
34:39needs to come to me,
34:40and the people who were expressing
34:42their pain need to now take care of me.
34:44That is other fragility people
34:47are talking about.
34:48So you have to have the capacity
34:50to not be the center right,
34:52to not require to be the center
34:55of attention and to be able to be
34:58supportive and bear witness and to
35:00lean in because it is an honor.
35:03When our clients or our colleagues are
35:06willing to share with us their experience,
35:09we also want to be careful
35:11about performative allyship.
35:12And many people have confessed that.
35:15They said what they thought
35:16other people needed to hear,
35:17even though they didn't believe it,
35:19they were afraid of the consequences
35:21that they didn't say it.
35:22And I will say the only path to
35:25liberation is truth telling,
35:27and so we are not looking for
35:30people to pretend.
35:31We are looking for authenticity
35:32and then we can know where do
35:35we go from there once we know
35:37what's actually in the room.
35:39We also want to be careful
35:42about people idealizing,
35:43which is another form of
35:45dehumanizing people of color.
35:47So a response that I often get
35:50will be things like Tayma.
35:51I just love black women,
35:53you all our goddesses.
35:55Well, a goddess can't be tired.
35:59A goddess can't be overwhelmed, right?
36:01A goddess and and there's
36:04no room for imperfection.
36:05So while we can appreciate each other,
36:08we want to make sure that we see
36:11people in their full humanity and and
36:15and that is what is most honorable.
36:18Another piece is when we say that
36:21talking about racism is divisive.
36:24Yeah,
36:24I think you all know last year
36:25the word of the year,
36:26I think by Webster's was gaslighting, right?
36:29And I want to say what a form of
36:32gaslighting it is for racism to
36:35be pervasive and then to claim
36:38that people who talk about it
36:40are the ones creating division.
36:43Like that's masterful.
36:44I mean like whoever came up
36:45with that strategy,
36:47that's really something else, right?
36:49So I am harming you.
36:51And if you name that I'm harming you,
36:54you are the problem.
36:57So we want to shift out of that.
37:00When I was a graduate student and I
37:03was working on my master's thesis,
37:05I had one paragraph in my draft
37:07of of my article that was talking
37:10about racism and sexism in their
37:12role in racial and gender identity,
37:14their effect on racial and gender identity,
37:17and my advisor at the time.
37:19Who is a very well respected researcher,
37:25white male, said to me, Tayma,
37:28And he really was trying to be helpful.
37:30He said to me, Tayma,
37:32you can leave that paragraph in there
37:35or you could take the High Road and
37:37take that out and get published.
37:39I want you to hear the ways in which
37:44we can collaborate and even mentor.
37:48People out of truth and not
37:52Createspace for it.
37:54So we also want to be mindful that we
37:58should not try to dictate how people
38:01of color feel or how they respond to
38:04inequity and to racism and you know it.
38:09We wouldn't do that with any
38:11other form of trauma, right?
38:13We wouldn't say to a survivor. Of war.
38:18Of partner abuse. Of molestation.
38:21You shouldn't feel like that.
38:23You should feel like this,
38:24or you shouldn't express yourself
38:25in this way, or you should not
38:28think about justice in this way.
38:30So we want to show up with each
38:33other with cultural humility,
38:35with courage,
38:36and with consistency.
38:37This can't be a passing fad.
38:40It is a commitment to the ways
38:43in which we will live and work.
38:46So in African psychology,
38:47an important notion is not just focusing
38:50on people's labor or productivity,
38:53but on their being.
38:54And a lot of times in our field,
38:56we focus a lot on functioning,
38:58and we translate functioning
39:00to school and work.
39:02But it is important that we tune into
39:05people's being and that we also not
39:08stop our work with looking at the
39:11cessation of symptoms of distress.
39:14Because someone may no longer be
39:16suicidal but have no joy, right?
39:18It's not just about symptom cessation.
39:20They may no longer be cutting but
39:22not have a sense of purpose or
39:25sense of clarity about themselves.
39:27So we want to look at those other
39:29principles that some referred
39:31to as positive psychology,
39:33as community psychology,
39:35as post traumatic growth,
39:37so from a liberation standpoint.
39:40To practice a liberation oriented
39:43care is to contextualize your care,
39:46as also when we think about
39:48decolonizing psychology,
39:49many times psychology is focused on
39:52the individual and overlooking the
39:55systems that affect the individual's
39:57lives of multiple systems.
39:59And so if you have a girl client
40:03with an eating disorder and do
40:05you only look at it in terms of
40:07her having cognitive distortions?
40:10And maybe you look at the
40:11dieting practices of our mother,
40:13but you have not looked at the
40:15ways in which girls and women are
40:18bombarded with messages about
40:20their bodies and about control
40:23and about attractiveness.
40:25In the media and dating circles,
40:28if you are not looking at that
40:30larger picture and you're putting
40:32that full weight on this 13 year
40:34old that for some reason you
40:36have a cognitive distortion,
40:38right? And we're not going to look
40:40at what are the things that gave
40:42you those thoughts about yourself,
40:44then we are missing it. Right.
40:46So from a liberation standpoint,
40:49we say not only do we want to consider
40:51what we are trying to dismantle or disrupt,
40:54which is racism and other
40:56forms of oppression,
40:57but for us to imagine what is it that we
41:00are trying to build or cocreate, right?
41:03What would it look like for this family
41:05to live in a liberated state of being?
41:08What would it look like for this child to
41:10have a sense of freedom within themselves,
41:13within their bodies,
41:14within their minds and culturally
41:16about who they are?
41:17So it is actively anti oppression,
41:20it is holistic and many of our
41:22interventions leave out the body.
41:24And I am so excited about the advances
41:26that are being made around embodied care,
41:29trauma, informed yoga.
41:31That awareness also about where
41:33we hold stress in our bodies.
41:36And the ways we can shift our nervous
41:39system with regulation and coregulation,
41:42these are all very important.
41:45So liberation psychology originated
41:47out of Latin America and it is
41:51really a place of empowering.
41:53A big distinction is not stopping at
41:56the point of coping strategies but
41:58also looking at resistance strategies.
42:01So it's not enough to have a
42:03child who is faced racism.
42:05And simply tell them you know,
42:08to journal color and take deep breaths.
42:10Those are good coping strategies.
42:12But then we have a responsibility
42:14to also look at what you may think
42:17more of as problem solving coping,
42:19not just emotional focus coping.
42:21So the problem solving coping or the
42:24resistance strategies are what are
42:26possibilities that this family may
42:28want to do to follow as a result
42:31of the housing discrimination or
42:32the discrimination that happened in
42:34their classroom or in their school.
42:37And so this is a big distinction
42:40between traditional models of trauma
42:43recovery and liberation oriented care.
42:46For trauma recovery you also want
42:49to attend to intersectionality.
42:51And so racism shows up in different ways
42:54based on other aspects of your identity.
42:57Your sexuality, your gender,
43:00your socioeconomic status, your age.
43:02All of those affect the ways in
43:04which people respond to you.
43:06So in our assessment,
43:07we want to just ask not what
43:09is wrong with this child,
43:11what is wrong with this family.
43:13We want to think about what
43:14has happened to them,
43:15not only individually and as a family,
43:17but as a community.
43:19What are the violations that this community
43:22that this cultural group has experienced?
43:25And so when you are doing your trauma
43:28history intake to be willing to ask
43:32questions about microaggressions,
43:34discrimination, stereotypes, colorism,
43:37racially motivated bullying and harassment,
43:42police brutality,
43:43vicarious racial trauma,
43:46intergenerational trauma?
43:47When we look at your case,
43:49conceptualization and your treatment plan,
43:53if you have erased this person's identity,
43:58then you are not providing ethical care.
44:01By our ethics guidelines,
44:03we have to attend to who is in
44:06the room in their fullness.
44:07And so your assessment is going
44:10to dictate your conceptualization,
44:12which is going to dictate
44:13your treatment plan.
44:14So if I never ask about racism.
44:18And then it is not likely to be
44:20addressed and it sets the tone for us
44:23to engage in anti racism therapy for
44:25us to be able to frame it by saying,
44:28as we frame the trauma assessment that
44:31many people have experienced racism.
44:34And I'm aware that that can really
44:36have an effect on people's mental
44:38health or I'm aware that they can
44:40really have an effect on your feelings,
44:42your thoughts, your actions.
44:43And I wonder if you can share with
44:46me if that has been a part of your
44:48experience and how you have coped with that.
44:53I have a healing racial trauma
44:55model and there are other models.
44:57This is important to share because when
44:59we started doing this work or asking to,
45:02we've been asked to share more.
45:04After Black Lives Matter.
45:05When I share often in the Q&amp;A
45:08people will say things like it
45:10sounds like you all need a theory.
45:12There are many theories.
45:13There are many theories,
45:14so you just were not often
45:17exposed to them in your training.
45:20So we look at these themes based
45:24approaches to acknowledge racism to get
45:26to the place of us being able to share
45:30from that narrative therapy perspective,
45:32working on healing trust.
45:34Not only how do I discern who is trustworthy?
45:38In the environment around me,
45:41but also building trust within myself,
45:44reconnecting with myself and
45:47addressing internalized racism.
45:49Internalized racism is when you
45:51come to believe the lies you
45:53have been told about yourself.
45:55So if you are a black child who believes
45:58that black people are not as smart.
46:01If you are a Latina who believes
46:04that Latinas are not as attractive
46:06as non Latino white girls,
46:08then this is the internalization
46:11that requires healing.
46:13If you are Asian American and
46:16have experienced the colorism and
46:18believe that you would be better
46:20if you have been born lighter.
46:23So this is the the the work that we
46:25need to do Not only the external work
46:28with how do I navigate these systems,
46:30but also how do I come home
46:33to myself and heal myself.
46:35We need to have space for
46:36people to grieve the losses,
46:38and this is includes for
46:40the parents or grandparents.
46:41What were the things that
46:43racism took from them?
46:44Some of them had dreams that were not
46:46realized and the blockage was not a matter
46:49of them not being willing to work hard.
46:51But the realities of discrimination,
46:54xenophobia and racism.
46:57We have to have places where people can
46:59talk about their anger and their outrage.
47:02We do want to give the coping strategies of
47:05what are ways that we can soothe ourselves,
47:08but then also the resistance
47:10strategies as well.
47:12We want to integrate
47:14indigenous ways of healing,
47:16So it is.
47:18Not by accident that we often
47:22utilize the expressive arts.
47:24It is not by accident that
47:25we have discovered the gift,
47:27the healing gift of storytelling.
47:29These are culturally rich traditions
47:31that often are not acknowledged in
47:33terms of where we got them from.
47:35We act like we discovered and we gave
47:37it a name and say like if you're
47:39healing strategy started in the 1980s,
47:41I encourage you to dig a little deeper.
47:44That there are communities that were
47:47using those strategies long before
47:49that there are a number of healing
47:51racial trauma models to look at.
47:53The Association of Black Psychologists
47:55has emotional emancipation
47:57circles which are community based,
47:59drop in groups.
48:00Soulfulness is some incredible
48:03culturally contextualized work
48:04similar to mindfulness but
48:06with culture at the forefront.
48:08Done by Shelley Harrell.
48:11Ubuntu Optimal Psychology Yoga for Healing
48:15Racial Trauma Testimonials is an
48:18aspect of liberation psychology
48:20which is that narrative piece of
48:22how do people tell their stories?
48:25And for those of you who use many of
48:28these mainstream models to look at,
48:30how do I apply them to racism?
48:33So there is work on EMDR applied with racism,
48:37cognitive processing,
48:38mindfulness based therapy,
48:40psychodynamic and humanistic
48:42approaches as well.
48:44So I am grateful that you're willing or
48:47some of you may be willing to do this work.
48:49I'm going to say because you showed up,
48:51although some people may have
48:52just shown up out of curiosity.
48:54But I am hopeful that you are willing to
48:57be a part of the solution and I believe
48:59we can shift the tide in some beautiful ways.
49:02And so I want to just say to you,
49:05it is not just about cultural competence,
49:08It is about being actively
49:10engaged in anti oppression work.
49:13This is not a Sprint,
49:15it's a marathon.
49:16And I hope you will join me.
49:19I'm ready to take your questions
49:20and I'll just put these two
49:22resources up on the screen.
49:24Thank you so much.
49:34Thank you so much, Doctor Bryant and Karen,
49:37I wasn't sure if there's anything
49:39you wanted to add before we jump in.
49:42If folks want to collect their
49:44thoughts and share any questions
49:46that they have for Doctor Bryant,
49:53you asked me if I have anything else?
49:56No, we were checking on Karen.
49:58Whether he had anything that he
50:00needed to say for housekeeping things
50:01before we open it up to questions.
50:04No, we're we're all good.
50:05I'm here in the Cohen.
50:07Excellent. All right, well,
50:09if folks, do you have questions,
50:11feel free to drop them in the chat
50:16or. Oh, I see some hands.
50:21Sajad, you want to go ahead?
50:26Sure,
50:30right. Hello. Thank you,
50:31Doctor Brian for such an incredible
50:34and amazing presentation.
50:36I'm also a psychology fellow and
50:37actually in the trauma track.
50:39So this is a huge, you know,
50:41interest of mine and I love to learn
50:43about different ways we can conceptualize
50:45and work with trauma and of course.
50:48The trauma lens and different theories.
50:50I was diligently taking notes as you were
50:53presenting one of the questions that I had.
50:55So you know, the child Study center,
50:57a lot of times we have a
50:59lot of sessions where,
51:00you know, with all kid work,
51:01we're meeting with parents and caregivers,
51:02we're meeting with kids.
51:04And you know, sometimes they have differing
51:06views of racism or their experiences.
51:09So just kind of was wondering,
51:12you know,
51:12how best to navigate those discrepancies
51:14if they are in terms of conceptualization,
51:17how we communicate with the
51:19families and children,
51:20even intervention,
51:21I was just kind of wondering about that.
51:29I'm sorry, I was cutting in and out.
51:31So you were asking,
51:33the families have different views
51:34and how do we address that?
51:36They have different views.
51:38Yeah. Stuff like the parents
51:39experiences are different than,
51:41you know, the child or the adolescent
51:44in terms of racism or just their
51:46experiences of it here. Yes,
51:49Beautiful. This is so important for
51:53us to invite parents or grandparents.
51:56Whoever are the key family members who
52:00are attending, if they are willing
52:02to share a part of their story and
52:05what their experiences have been,
52:07there is a wealth of wisdom there, and
52:10sometimes those stories have not been shared.
52:14And for some parents it is that it's painful
52:18and they don't want to think about it.
52:21For some, it is this idea that.
52:26They don't want to burden their
52:29children with those realities,
52:31but it can be helpful for us to
52:35share that from our experience.
52:37And you know, from our research,
52:40we know that it can be a gift and that
52:43children can be empowered when they learn
52:47about how we survived what we survived.
52:51And if they want to start with instead
52:54of the experiences of the racism,
52:57more so about the cultural
52:59richness and heritage.
53:01Because I think when we talk
53:03about intergenerational conflict,
53:05especially among families where there's
53:07a more recent immigration history,
53:10then sometimes the the kids association
53:12can be this is the like a culture of rules
53:16or it's all the things I can't do but they.
53:20Have not always received
53:22like the gift of it right,
53:23the beauty of it and so encouraging
53:26that storytelling is important and also
53:29to encourage the children to share,
53:31because if the ways in which
53:34racism shows up now,
53:36some of it is consistent over time.
53:39And some of it is some new ways.
53:40When we think about,
53:41for example,
53:41cyberbullying and racism online,
53:43these are pieces that many of
53:46the the parents or other family
53:48members may not be tuned into.
53:57Thank you for that really
53:59thoughtful response.
54:01Do other folks have questions?
54:02I'm pretty sure we have
54:03time for at least one.
54:04Oh good, we've got Tara here.
54:11Go ahead. Yeah. Perfect.
54:14Well, Doctor Bryant, thank you.
54:16I just need to say,
54:17I saw you talk at Smith College many,
54:20many summers ago, and you walked in
54:23and you started your talk with song.
54:26And you stood with me all these years,
54:29so I was so glad to see
54:31that you did that again.
54:33So just a little note,
54:34because it was really nice,
54:35like still singing. Yeah.
54:37But it was really nice to just
54:39see someone start an academic
54:41conversation as a complete human.
54:42So I really appreciated that.
54:46Additionally I I just your talk,
54:49thank you so much and it was so
54:51validating because we're doing,
54:53we do a lot of evidence based treatment
54:55here and there's a lot of conversation
54:58about how you have to adjust.
55:02In how you deliver this,
55:03these evidence based treatments to
55:05make room for the storytelling,
55:07to make room for the fact that
55:08this could be the first time that
55:10an individual has ever felt like
55:12they could share their story,
55:13or even given space or permission to do so,
55:17and the importance of shifting
55:19away from the number of sessions.
55:22But instead to the clinical goals of
55:25the session and ensuring that you're
55:28making the cultural and racially
55:31and linguistically appropriate
55:33adjustments to allow an entire human
55:36beings experience into the room
55:38in a way that resonates for them.
55:40And that isn't about the way we
55:42believe the treatment needs to be.
55:45Yes, absolutely. I want to thank
55:47you for saying that because it also
55:49triggered a very important not a
55:52negatively trigger reminded me of a
55:54very important thing I want to say.
55:56If you are going to elicit information,
56:00you have to 1st identify where you stand,
56:05because if I don't know you.
56:09To be a trustworthy person
56:10as it relates to racism,
56:12I might think you're very trustworthy if you
56:14want to talk about physical child abuse.
56:16But if I'm not clear of how
56:19you think about it,
56:20it is not going to be safe for me to share.
56:23And my mother was in a
56:26group for senior women,
56:29older women and the facilitators.
56:31They were all black women as it as it was
56:35the facilitator was a young white woman.
56:38Who said, you know,
56:39there's been a lot happening in the news.
56:41Like, how do you guys feel about that?
56:43And my mom just said, like,
56:44the group just went silent because, you know,
56:48they don't know how you think about it.
56:52So you're trying to, like,
56:52extract information from me, but like,
56:55where do you stand before you ask
56:58me to share what I think about it?
57:00So you want to be mindful of that
57:03in in in any form of oppression
57:06and in particular when you don't
57:09have the same identity.
57:11And I saw one last thing in the chat and
57:15then I do have to jump off for another zoom.
57:18My apologies,
57:18but it I think,
57:20was asking about indigenous
57:22approaches and it is very important
57:25to recognize the distinction between.
57:28Acknowledgement and appropriation, right.
57:31So if there is a culturally specific
57:36ritual that you are not trained
57:41or empowered to do,
57:43it's not for you to facilitate that.
57:45I had a Native American client who.
57:48Talked about how her therapist tried
57:50to start with having them stand
57:51and acknowledge the four wins and
57:53she was looking at this therapist
57:55like who are you like and who gave
57:57you the right to do that.
57:58So you know the way to to enter it is when
58:02we think about solutions focused therapy.
58:05So asking people when you were doing
58:07your best or feeling your most nourished
58:09in general and then as it relates
58:11to your culture what were practices
58:13or things that you were doing.
58:16And sometimes when we're stressed
58:18and traumatized,
58:19we have like let go of those things.
58:21So it may be, oh, you know,
58:23I used to do this. I used to do that.
58:25And so as a part of my healing,
58:28I want to start doing that again.
58:30And then we'll continue to check in to say,
58:32okay this week.
58:33Were you able to do it or what's
58:35the plan to do it?
58:37So you want to be thoughtful
58:39and careful about that.
58:40And thank you all so much for having me.
58:43Thank you so much, Doctor Brian and you,
58:47I can see that there are many
58:49more questions coming up.
58:50And so your talk has certainly
58:52brought up questions for a
58:54continued dialogue for us.
58:56Thank you so much for taking the time.
58:58And I should say APA has just released
59:01a book on Decolonizing psychology.
59:04They have a book that came out two
59:06years ago on liberation psychology.
59:08So you can read more of the
59:09theory and the background,
59:11but thank you and you all take good care.
59:14Wonderful. Thank you so much.
59:15Have a good rest of the day everyone,
59:16and thank you for joining.