Liberation Psychology: Addressing the Wounds of Racism

Transcript

• 00:03Great. Well, good afternoon again everyone
• 00:05and welcome to a very special Grand Rounds.
• 00:09So this Grand Rounds is hosted
• 00:11by our psychology Fellows.
• 00:13This is our second in our series
• 00:14of our trainee takeovers.
• 00:16So thank you very much for joining us both
• 00:19here in the Cohen Auditorium and remotely.
• 00:22And and just a reminder
• 00:25about Grand Rounds next week,
• 00:27we will have talks from our T32.
• 00:30Trainees, So we'll hear from Alan Gerber,
• 00:32Peter Castagna and friends,
• 00:34and Jessica Penner.
• 00:35So please do join us for
• 00:38those three talks next week.
• 00:40And with no further ado,
• 00:42I will pass you over to Kara and
• 00:45Danny to host Brand Ryan's for today.
• 00:52Hello. All right, so we will start out
• 00:54just by briefly introducing ourselves.
• 00:56So my name is Kara Tomasso.
• 00:58I am the first year soon to be second year.
• 01:01I'm pediatric psychology fellow
• 01:03and I'm Danny Novick and I too am
• 01:07the first soon to be second year
• 01:09fellow in the early childhood track.
• 01:13Good to see everyone,
• 01:14and we are absolutely thrilled to
• 01:16introduce today's Grand Round speaker,
• 01:18Doctor Tama Bryant.
• 01:19When we and the other fellows were
• 01:21talking about who we'd like to invite,
• 01:24we knew we wanted someone whose
• 01:26clinical practice and research would
• 01:27have implications for our own work
• 01:29aimed at improving the lives of
• 01:31the children and families who come
• 01:32to the Yale Child Study Center.
• 01:34And Doctor Bryant goes above
• 01:36and beyond this criterion.
• 01:38You know,
• 01:39her work and lived experiences cut to
• 01:41the core of many of the challenges
• 01:43that the children and families
• 01:44we serve are up against sexism,
• 01:46racism, trauma,
• 01:47and grief.
• 01:47But perhaps what is most beautiful
• 01:50about Doctor Bryant's work is that
• 01:52the common thread across her many,
• 01:54many accomplishments is her focus
• 01:56on advocacy,
• 01:57improving accessibility to
• 01:59mental health resources,
• 02:00decolonizing psychology as a discipline
• 02:02in keeping humanity and her core
• 02:05values at the heart of it all.
• 02:07Doctor Bryant is a professor
• 02:09of psychology and the Graduate
• 02:10School of Education and Psychology
• 02:12at Pepperdine University,
• 02:14where she leads the Culture
• 02:16and Trauma Research Laboratory.
• 02:17She's the past president of the
• 02:19Society for the Psychology of Women
• 02:21and the current president of the
• 02:23American Psychological Association,
• 02:25and it's even found time.
• 02:26It's sometime in there to earn a
• 02:28master's of divinity and become
• 02:29an ordained minister.
• 02:30To list all of her athletes
• 02:32would take the full grand rounds,
• 02:34and then them.
• 02:35She is one of the foremost experts
• 02:37on the trauma of racism and she's
• 02:39edited an APA book for clinicians
• 02:42called Multicultural Feminist Therapy
• 02:44Helping Adolescent Girls of Color to Thrive,
• 02:46which presents a strength spaced,
• 02:48multicultural feminist lens to guide
• 02:50work with black and brown teenage girls.
• 02:53She's also the host of the mental
• 02:55health podcast Homecoming and
• 02:57author of the book Homecoming
• 02:59Overcome Fear and Trauma to Reclaim
• 03:01Your Whole Authentic Self.
• 03:02And coauthor of The Anti Racism Handbook,
• 03:05practical tools to shift your mindset and
• 03:07uproot racism in your life and community.
• 03:10We are so very grateful for
• 03:12your willingness to share your
• 03:13knowledge with us today, Dr.
• 03:14Brian.
• 03:15So please join us in giving a
• 03:17warm welcome to Dr.
• 03:18Brian as she presents on liberation
• 03:20psychology and addressing
• 03:21the wounds of racism.
• 03:24Thank you so much.
• 03:26I am so grateful to be with you all.
• 03:30And I come to you with a very,
• 03:32very full heart.
• 03:33Often when we think about
• 03:36racism and addressing racism,
• 03:38the initial emotional response
• 03:41for many people is anxiety
• 03:44or dread or anger or despair.
• 03:47And I want you to know that working to
• 03:51combat racism is driven by a great,
• 03:54great sense of love.
• 03:56A great sense of love and
• 03:58compassion for us to do this labor,
• 04:01where there is space and room
• 04:03for us to not only survive,
• 04:05but to grow and to flourish.
• 04:09And many times this is a
• 04:11topic that is avoided.
• 04:13And so I am so appreciative for
• 04:16your students and faculty for
• 04:19intentionally making space for
• 04:22us to collectively look at our.
• 04:26Intentional work to dismantle and
• 04:28disrupt racism and other forms of
• 04:32oppression and all of their forms in
• 04:34the lives of children and families.
• 04:37And many times we are waiting for
• 04:40and expecting someone else to do it.
• 04:42And I want to say in the words of
• 04:45sweet honey in the rock, we are the ones.
• 04:49We are the ones we've been waiting for.
• 04:54We are the ones. We are the ones.
• 04:58We are the ones we've been waiting for.
• 05:02And my 4 parents of the Civil Rights
• 05:06movement would say if not us,
• 05:09who If not now, when? If not us, who?
• 05:12If not now, when?
• 05:14So it is not for someone else to do.
• 05:17Many before us have been doing this work.
• 05:20And so we honor them, celebrate them,
• 05:22and make a commitment that we
• 05:24will not drop the baton,
• 05:26but we will not look for
• 05:28somebody else to run our lap.
• 05:30But each of us has a responsibility to
• 05:33do this work. So I will share my screen.
• 05:47So we are thinking about healing the
• 05:50wounds of racism approaching and
• 05:53integrating liberation psychology.
• 05:56My pronouns are she, her, and hers.
• 05:58I am a woman of African descent.
• 06:01As you heard,
• 06:02I'm a psychologist and a minister.
• 06:04But I'm also relational, mother,
• 06:06daughter, sister, partner,
• 06:07friends, scholar, learner.
• 06:09And I invite you and the students
• 06:12to resist colonized notions
• 06:14that say that to be professional
• 06:17we have to erase ourselves.
• 06:19And I tell my students at Pepperdine,
• 06:22if you get to the point of commencement
• 06:24and you have left yourself behind,
• 06:27we have robbed you.
• 06:28There is no point in having a diverse
• 06:31field if everyone believes they
• 06:32have to be clone of each other,
• 06:35but instead for us to intentionally
• 06:37show up in the fullness and
• 06:40richness of our various identities.
• 06:43I am coming to you from the land
• 06:45that's been cultivated by the Tonga
• 06:47peoples and other indigenous peoples.
• 06:49I encourage you to identify,
• 06:52discover, acknowledge,
• 06:53appreciate those who cultivated the
• 06:55land on which you work and gather.
• 06:58Not only as a matter of history,
• 07:00but also to become aware of their
• 07:03vibrant cultures in the present,
• 07:05their challenges and contributions.
• 07:07We are more familiar with land recognition,
• 07:10but a labor recognition is also important.
• 07:13We want to be mindful that the
• 07:16United States is a relatively large,
• 07:18relatively short lived nation.
• 07:20And yet it has developed at an
• 07:24accelerated pace and a big part of that
• 07:27development was based on exploited labor,
• 07:30largely the labor historically
• 07:32of people of African descent.
• 07:35And we recognize that there continues
• 07:37to be exploited labor to today.
• 07:39And so we do not want to erase that reality.
• 07:43I want to also name that we are
• 07:45gathering at a time where the socio
• 07:48political climate has much hostility,
• 07:50instability and overt violence.
• 07:52We are dealing with the echoes of Pandemic,
• 07:56and I am aware that in each of
• 07:58these boxes there is a story.
• 08:00And so even though you provide
• 08:02care for others,
• 08:04I want you to know that we
• 08:06ourselves are worthy of care.
• 08:08And I recognize that each of us
• 08:10have visible and invisible losses.
• 08:12And so I invite you to take a moment
• 08:15of inhaling in through your nose
• 08:19and exhaling out through the mouth.
• 08:24I also want to say that as we
• 08:26are seeking to address racism,
• 08:28many universities are comfortable
• 08:30as long as we are talking about
• 08:33helping people cope with racism that
• 08:35is happening somewhere out there.
• 08:38If we're talking about children
• 08:40seeing school shootings or students
• 08:43witnessing police brutality,
• 08:44there can be a certain level of openness.
• 08:50But when students and others
• 08:52begin to talk about oppression
• 08:55and racism in particular within
• 08:57our field or within our campus,
• 09:00people often get uncomfortable and will
• 09:03label them troublemakers or say that
• 09:06they are always complaining and we
• 09:09have to be willing to see the wounds
• 09:11in all of the places they show up.
• 09:14Which include in your department?
• 09:17Which include in your curriculum,
• 09:19which include in your clinics.
• 09:22And I want to say to you,
• 09:24as a feminist psychologist,
• 09:26a womanist psychologist,
• 09:28I resist and reject the myth of neutrality.
• 09:32So some people pretend that they're neutral
• 09:34and that everybody else has a worldview,
• 09:37and I don't think you can
• 09:39get more colonized than that,
• 09:40than to believe the way you see the world.
• 09:43Is simply truth and everybody else is
• 09:46coming from a slanted perspective.
• 09:49So it is important for us all to
• 09:52recognize that we show up to this
• 09:55work with a lived reality and also an
• 09:59intergenerational reality, and so that truth.
• 10:02Is not the problem.
• 10:04It is the lack of awareness and
• 10:07acknowledgement of that which is problematic.
• 10:09And so each of us,
• 10:11when we look at what we research,
• 10:13when we look at the ways in
• 10:15which we practice,
• 10:16those have been formed as a
• 10:19result of our socialization,
• 10:20not just our professional lens,
• 10:24but our lived experience.
• 10:27And that is an important place of launching.
• 10:32So I am a lover of words and proverbs,
• 10:36Lucille Clifton,
• 10:37an African American poet,
• 10:39wrote Come and celebrate with
• 10:42me that every day something has
• 10:45tried to kill me and has failed.
• 10:48And there's a Mexican proverb
• 10:50which says they tried to bury us.
• 10:52They didn't know we were seeds.
• 10:54So these two proverbs are really
• 10:57a reminder for us to hold both
• 11:00the realities of racial trauma.
• 11:03As well as stories of triumph,
• 11:06of overcoming A flourishing.
• 11:07So we do not want to come away from
• 11:11this conversation with a notion
• 11:13of pity and that these are people
• 11:16who need to be rescued,
• 11:17but instead from a place of acknowledging
• 11:20the wounds and the strengths,
• 11:23the contributions,
• 11:24the clarity and the distress.
• 11:28That we want to see each other
• 11:31in our full humanity,
• 11:32which will then put us in a position
• 11:35to work collaboratively instead of
• 11:37adopting A Messiah complex where
• 11:39we believe we know what is best
• 11:41for other people
• 11:48and it doesn't. There we go.
• 11:51So one of the things that we want
• 11:53to be able to acknowledge is the
• 11:56realities of racial stress and trauma.
• 11:58Audrey Lorde wrote This woman is black,
• 12:01so her blood is shed in silence.
• 12:03So you want to think about what are
• 12:07the traumas that you have learned
• 12:09about as traumas and what are the
• 12:12traumas that you have difficulty or
• 12:15push back in acknowledging our traumas.
• 12:18So the notion of PTSD was developed
• 12:22thinking about veterans and we
• 12:24consider post traumatic stress disorder
• 12:26that they came home from battle.
• 12:28And then it was a part of our
• 12:31work to help them to recover.
• 12:33And then there was push back
• 12:34in the field to say, well,
• 12:35wait a minute, what about molestation?
• 12:37What about intimate partner violence?
• 12:40And at first people said,
• 12:41well, they didn't go to war.
• 12:42That doesn't count.
• 12:43And then the case was made that some
• 12:46People's War was in their childhood bedrooms,
• 12:48some were on school yards,
• 12:50some were in alleyways.
• 12:52And so there was a broadening of our
• 12:55understanding of what comprised trauma.
• 12:58So there has been a push in the
• 13:01field for the acknowledgement of
• 13:04what is called societal trauma,
• 13:07or some call it intergenerational
• 13:09or historical trauma,
• 13:10or race based or racism based trauma,
• 13:14as well as other forms of
• 13:17oppression that sexism.
• 13:18And sexual trauma can be traumatizing
• 13:22as well as the forms of oppression
• 13:26when we think of heterosexism,
• 13:29classism, ableism, ageism.
• 13:31And there have been those in the field,
• 13:37trauma experts in the field,
• 13:40who have sought to deny this reality.
• 13:43And so you want to ask yourself what and who?
• 13:48Benefits from the discipline
• 13:51silence on racial trauma.
• 13:53And I have had people say things like,
• 13:56well, intimate partner violence
• 13:58is a capital T trauma,
• 14:00but racial trauma would be a lower
• 14:02case T trauma because it is,
• 14:04quote,
• 14:05just emotional abuse.
• 14:08And anyone who thinks that racism
• 14:11is just emotional abuse has
• 14:13not been paying attention.
• 14:15So when we talk about the threat
• 14:18to people's very lives and safety,
• 14:20it is important to recognize that racism
• 14:24is not just a mere matter of bias.
• 14:27We get very comfortable with the word bias,
• 14:29and people prefer you use the word bias
• 14:32than racism because it sounds very soft.
• 14:35It's very palatable.
• 14:36It is very acceptable that we
• 14:39all have biases but people?
• 14:41Become hesitant to use the word
• 14:44racism unless it is a Klan member.
• 14:47And then even at that point they will
• 14:50question the use of the terminology racism.
• 14:53I want to say in our work for the
• 14:56American Psychological Association
• 14:58that we recognize that racism
• 15:00is not only interpersonal,
• 15:02that it is systemic, it is structural,
• 15:05It is institutionalized.
• 15:08Racism is unavoidable.
• 15:10So if it was only a matter
• 15:13of individual biases,
• 15:14then we could tell children and
• 15:16families who know that someone
• 15:18is racist to just avoid them.
• 15:21If you have someone on your street who
• 15:23doesn't like black or brown people,
• 15:25or doesn't like Asian people,
• 15:27just stay out of their yard, right?
• 15:29It sounds like a simple solution.
• 15:31But when we recognize that,
• 15:33not by a matter of opinion but by
• 15:37documented science, that racism
• 15:39shows up in the educational system,
• 15:41that it shows up in the healthcare system,
• 15:44that it shows up in the criminal
• 15:46justice system, that it shows up
• 15:48in the banking and loan system,
• 15:49that it shows up in the application
• 15:52process for jobs and for colleges, then we.
• 15:55Understand that to apply our
• 15:58science ethically does not mean
• 16:01just teaching people to ignore it.
• 16:04Whereas some people will say
• 16:05you all talk about it too much,
• 16:06maybe if you didn't talk about it,
• 16:08it wouldn't be a problem,
• 16:09and it is that silencing denial and
• 16:14erasure which multiplies the issue.
• 16:17We understand from the work of
• 16:20Judith Herman that perpetrators
• 16:22only require our silence.
• 16:25Silence protects what is in power.
• 16:28Silence protects the status quo.
• 16:31Silence protects what already is.
• 16:33And so we have to lean into the discomfort
• 16:36of being able to address racism.
• 16:39Some people will say,
• 16:40well,
• 16:40they don't want to bring this
• 16:42topic up with children because
• 16:44they don't want to upset them.
• 16:47So the lack of socialization,
• 16:49the lack of preparation.
• 16:51The lack of acknowledgement is a set
• 16:54up for children to feel the shame
• 16:57and self blame of their individual
• 17:00selves instead of recognizing what is
• 17:03happening within them and around them
• 17:06on a structural and systemic level,
• 17:09and also to be able to empower
• 17:12and encourage our families
• 17:13to proactively address it.
• 17:16And to teach our children not just
• 17:19about racism but racial identity.
• 17:22So that your introduction to it is
• 17:25not just that some people may not
• 17:28like me because of my identity,
• 17:30but it is also for them to recognize
• 17:34the gifts and the history and the
• 17:37legacy that comes with their heritage.
• 17:40And so some people will say,
• 17:42well, this makes sense.
• 17:44If your client is already really
• 17:47immersed in their culture,
• 17:48but if,
• 17:49for example,
• 17:50they had intercultural adoption
• 17:52or international adoption,
• 17:54or they did not grow up being
• 17:56familiar with it,
• 17:57then that perhaps we should not say anything.
• 18:00And I appreciate the work of Doctor
• 18:02Manuel and the Chicano Affirmative
• 18:05Psychotherapy Institute who says if a
• 18:08client has never heard of mindfulness.
• 18:10We don't say I'm not going to mention
• 18:13it to them because it's not already
• 18:15an understanding that they have.
• 18:17Likewise,
• 18:18if someone does not already know
• 18:21their culture and cultural identity,
• 18:24it doesn't make sense to say,
• 18:25well,
• 18:25I'm not going to mention it when
• 18:28we consider what are the protected
• 18:30factors and the tools that help people
• 18:33to not only survive but thrive.
• 18:35As we think about racism,
• 18:37it's important to know there is the
• 18:40historical and intergenerational piece
• 18:42as well as the contemporary reality.
• 18:44And so in terms of the historical piece,
• 18:46you want to consider the transmission
• 18:49of trauma across the generations.
• 18:52So trauma is documented to
• 18:54shift our nervous systems
• 18:56and then those shifts can be passed
• 18:58down to the next generation.
• 19:00The good news is we recognize
• 19:02that healing can also shift the
• 19:05nervous system and can also be
• 19:07passed down to the next generation.
• 19:09You want to consider,
• 19:10as we talk about racism,
• 19:12both what it means to be a primary target,
• 19:15what it also means to bear witness,
• 19:18and the impact of that
• 19:19on the lives of children,
• 19:21as well as vicarious traumatization.
• 19:24So even if they did not know
• 19:26the people personally.
• 19:27What is the impact of seeing on
• 19:29the news or in the community
• 19:32people of your shared identity,
• 19:34Being dehumanized, brutalized,
• 19:36and then a lack of justice?
• 19:39When we were having the surge
• 19:41of hate towards Asian Americans,
• 19:43hate crimes a number of my Asian
• 19:46American students talked about,
• 19:48even if they had not been directly targeted,
• 19:52that feeling of anxiety and
• 19:54dread and worry as they were.
• 19:57Concerned for members of their community
• 20:00and in particular their elders at
• 20:02that time and in an ongoing way.
• 20:04So it is not just about have the
• 20:06children you worked with in a way
• 20:09that is that they are conscious
• 20:10about been directly targeted.
• 20:13But what is the impact of these
• 20:16experiences that are pervasive
• 20:18in our communities?
• 20:21So the wounds of racial stress and
• 20:23trauma are important to acknowledge.
• 20:26Emotionally,
• 20:26people may show up with depression
• 20:28and I want to raise to your awareness
• 20:32irritable depression and for you
• 20:34to consider the stereotype of
• 20:37black women with a bad attitude.
• 20:40And so yes,
• 20:41we all can enjoy clients who come
• 20:43in with big smiles and gratitude
• 20:46and quickly saying that they have
• 20:48all these aha moments,
• 20:50but I want to really encourage
• 20:53your compassion.
• 20:54For the family members who
• 20:56show up with arms crossed,
• 20:57with legs crossed,
• 20:59keeping their coat buttoned up,
• 21:01keep keeping their purse and their lap and
• 21:04giving you what we would call a side eye,
• 21:07that we recognize.
• 21:08That from people's lived experience,
• 21:10it's not that they have trust issues,
• 21:13it is that systems have been
• 21:15untrustworthy and so it is not
• 21:18just to see them as the problem.
• 21:21But from liberation psychology,
• 21:23we understand the importance
• 21:25of problematization,
• 21:26where we actually recognize what
• 21:28is the root of what we are seeing
• 21:31in the present.
• 21:32So the irritability you want
• 21:34to attend to anxiety, anger.
• 21:36And many of us who are in the field
• 21:40have an issue with people's anger
• 21:42and we are quick to pathologize
• 21:44it and try to squash it.
• 21:47And I want to say to you,
• 21:48it is healthy for people to be
• 21:51outraged about outrageous things.
• 21:53Outrageous things have happened.
• 21:55And so we want to check ourselves in,
• 21:59our own healing about our issues
• 22:03and discomfort,
• 22:04sitting with people's outrage,
• 22:06and also what we have been taught
• 22:09about people of color.
• 22:12So I want you to think about your
• 22:15emotional response if,
• 22:16for example,
• 22:16you see a white woman who is
• 22:19angry versus your emotional
• 22:21response if a black or brown man
• 22:24is angry. And so we often we also
• 22:27see that with our adolescence and
• 22:31the ways in which anger and other
• 22:34emotional responses get racialized
• 22:36in terms of who is seen as a threat.
• 22:39And who is seen as a human
• 22:42being having a human response?
• 22:45We also consider substance dependence,
• 22:48suicidal thoughts, fatigue, dissociation.
• 22:50We want to also be mindful
• 22:53of the somatic complaints,
• 22:56where many may say it doesn't
• 22:57bother me but I have backache.
• 23:00It doesn't bother me, but I'm nauseous.
• 23:02It doesn't bother me, but I have
• 23:05migraines we want to consider difficult.
• 23:08Be concentrating, remembering and focusing,
• 23:10especially as we think about children
• 23:12and how they are doing in school.
• 23:14And this expectation for business as usual,
• 23:19that while there can be police
• 23:21brutality in your community,
• 23:23you are to show up the next day at school.
• 23:26No one speaks about it, no one names it,
• 23:29and you are expected to perform.
• 23:31And we want to think about the
• 23:33ways in which that is dehumanizing.
• 23:35Not only within the school systems,
• 23:37but also within our practices when we
• 23:41claim that we are doing a full assessment
• 23:44to find out about the stressors in
• 23:47our children's and families lives
• 23:49and we never ask about experiences
• 23:52of discrimination or bias or racism.
• 23:57Racism also creates barriers,
• 24:00barriers to educational possibility,
• 24:03economics and political resources.
• 24:05And when we talk about these barriers,
• 24:09some people again get uncomfortable
• 24:12because to name the barriers is to some
• 24:17people feel erase the ways in which
• 24:20people who are white have worked hard.
• 24:24And I want you to acknowledge that both
• 24:27things can exist on an individual level.
• 24:30People may have worked very hard and we
• 24:33are not dealing with a level playing field.
• 24:36And there are additional barriers
• 24:39that are put in front of some
• 24:43communities and families.
• 24:44Racism also has physical health consequences.
• 24:48Increased risk of injury, infection, asthma,
• 24:52cardiovascular disease initially with COVID.
• 24:56More losses once the vaccination came out.
• 24:59There were more people of color percentage
• 25:01wise who were getting vaccinated.
• 25:03Birthing complications.
• 25:04We have how I say we African American
• 25:08women have higher risk of mortality,
• 25:12death during pregnancy, maternal mortality.
• 25:16And then another piece we often don't
• 25:19address are the spiritual consequences.
• 25:21Many of our programs,
• 25:23when they talk about cultural competence,
• 25:26will only talk about race and ethnicity,
• 25:29maybe gender and sexuality,
• 25:31maybe talk about disability.
• 25:34But there has been a persistent erasure
• 25:39or pathologizing around spirituality.
• 25:43People of color and women endorse
• 25:47higher spirituality.
• 25:48And So what does it mean as a
• 25:51field for us to erase meaning,
• 25:53making and coping and understanding
• 25:56in these ways?
• 25:58And so it was in, I think,
• 26:01in my postdoctoral training the
• 26:04first time I heard this phrase,
• 26:07hyper religiosity.
• 26:08And as a pastor's daughter,
• 26:10I was definitely like,
• 26:12what is that?
• 26:13And I became clear very quickly
• 26:15that it was very subjective based
• 26:18on people's lived experience.
• 26:20So if someone grew up with no
• 26:23spirituality or religiosity,
• 26:24and they have a client who
• 26:26attends services twice a week,
• 26:28it will label them hyperreligious.
• 26:31Or there was a black mother who needed
• 26:33to make a decision about her son,
• 26:35and she told the therapist,
• 26:38I need to pray about it.
• 26:39I'll let you know next week.
• 26:41And he thought that was the most
• 26:43ridiculous thing he ever heard.
• 26:45So we want to be mindful and
• 26:49intentional about integrating and
• 26:51preparing our students and ourselves.
• 26:54Because of course,
• 26:55you cannot prepare others with you
• 26:57with what you are not prepared for.
• 26:59So we also have to educate ourselves about
• 27:02how to ethically and appropriately address,
• 27:05acknowledge, integrate people's
• 27:08spirituality and religious.
• 27:11Beliefs and practices.
• 27:12And that can start even simply within our our
• 27:17assessment process of asking the question.
• 27:20If you have a family for whom
• 27:22spirituality and religion is central
• 27:24and you have never spoken about it,
• 27:27that you don't actually know that family,
• 27:30You don't actually know them.
• 27:31If it's central to them
• 27:33and you don't know that,
• 27:35then you know a fraction of them.
• 27:37And so we want to be mindful of that,
• 27:40and I want to name around spirituality
• 27:42and religiosity that we have
• 27:44to be able to hold both ends,
• 27:47which is for some people it has
• 27:49been a major source of strength and
• 27:53resilience and meaning and coping.
• 27:56And for some people it has been a
• 27:58site of harm, of abuse, of rejection.
• 28:01And if we're not willing to
• 28:03acknowledge both of those things exist.
• 28:06Then we're missing it.
• 28:07So some of us who may be spiritual
• 28:10or religious are not willing to
• 28:12acknowledge harms that have been done,
• 28:14and some people who are tuned
• 28:16into the harms are unwilling to
• 28:18see the ways in which it could be
• 28:21beneficial or helpful to anyone.
• 28:24And those end up resulting in us not
• 28:31seeing people fully so in terms of the
• 28:34effects with racial stress and trauma.
• 28:36Many people who have worked to combat
• 28:39racism have been people of faith.
• 28:41And we can think about that in
• 28:44terms of needing to be able to see
• 28:46what is possible beyond what is,
• 28:48and trying to have some sense of hope or
• 28:51faith in the fact that things can get better.
• 28:54And at the same time,
• 28:57we want to think about,
• 28:58for some people,
• 28:59utilizing their religious coping,
• 29:01so gathering with their community,
• 29:04reading sacred texts.
• 29:05Prayer and we also want to think about
• 29:08for some how it may intensify notions
• 29:11of shame and stigma and self blame.
• 29:14So for example,
• 29:16sexual assault of young people if
• 29:18they believe that God is mad at them,
• 29:20or that now they are less because
• 29:22they are not a virgin or any.
• 29:24Or this pressure to instantly forgive.
• 29:28So we have to look at the nuance
• 29:31and the layers in order to support
• 29:33people in a holistic way.
• 29:35So as you are seeing the effects
• 29:38for children and for their families,
• 29:41you want to consider for yourself
• 29:44how you are responding to what
• 29:47they are showing you,
• 29:48whether there is compassion or judgment,
• 29:51whether there is the expectation
• 29:54for super strength or if we
• 29:57also recognize the the need.
• 30:00For a saving face or for honor means
• 30:04that many people of color may not
• 30:08come in visually falling apart.
• 30:10And because they are not putting
• 30:13their distress on display,
• 30:15sometimes we are quick to terminate them,
• 30:18Sometimes we are quick to say that they're
• 30:21not ready for change because of the
• 30:24ways in which they hold their distress.
• 30:27So if I hold it physically and spiritually,
• 30:30will you respond with the same compassion
• 30:32as someone who was sitting there in tears?
• 30:38So there are barriers that have kept us from
• 30:41engaging around racism and addressing it.
• 30:44For some it is denial.
• 30:46So the belief that either it doesn't
• 30:48exist or it's not that big a deal
• 30:51that it doesn't happen that much.
• 30:53And so if you are in denial,
• 30:54then you're going to say
• 30:56we shouldn't talk about it.
• 30:57And I I want to say with assessment,
• 31:01when we ask people about other issues,
• 31:04if it is not a personal concern of theirs,
• 31:07we don't think we did something
• 31:09wrong by asking, right?
• 31:10But as soon as we talk
• 31:12about sexism or racism,
• 31:13if we ask and people don't grab hold of it,
• 31:17then people will say, oh,
• 31:18I knew I shouldn't have asked about it.
• 31:20I'll never ask about it again.
• 31:22When we ask about substance
• 31:24use and people deny it,
• 31:25or when we ask about relationship
• 31:29abuse and people say no,
• 31:31that's not their experience,
• 31:32we don't then take it off the table.
• 31:35There are also mental health providers
• 31:37who minimize or who victim blame,
• 31:40and this is a key one.
• 31:41When you hear cases of police brutality,
• 31:44if your first response is,
• 31:47well, why did they run?
• 31:49For your first response in terms of the
• 31:52man who was killed on the subway train,
• 31:55if your response was, well,
• 31:57he was being loud,
• 31:59right?
• 31:59If you're If you are justifying the
• 32:02harms that have been done to people,
• 32:05it is going to be near impossible
• 32:08for you to be helpful ethically to
• 32:11clients who've experienced racism.
• 32:14There are others who are
• 32:16immobilized by guilt and fear.
• 32:19So you may feel like this is real and
• 32:22that it exists and it's problematic,
• 32:24but I'm afraid of saying the wrong
• 32:26thing or doing the wrong thing.
• 32:28So I will say nothing.
• 32:30And it is very important for us
• 32:31to lean into the discomfort,
• 32:33recognizing that when we're learning,
• 32:36we're going to make mistakes.
• 32:38The key is to acknowledge it and
• 32:40if there are ruptures with your
• 32:42client to be able to acknowledge it,
• 32:44apologize and learn from it
• 32:46and as we move forward.
• 32:48So the example that I like to give
• 32:51as a straight woman who seeks
• 32:53to be an ally or an accomplice
• 32:56with the L GB TQ community,
• 32:58that if someone tells me I said
• 33:01something wrong or did something wrong,
• 33:04it would be so problematic.
• 33:06If I said something like, well,
• 33:07at least I tried and you all
• 33:09didn't acknowledge that I tried,
• 33:10so I'm not going to try anymore,
• 33:12right?
• 33:13That would be very emotionally immature.
• 33:15And so the same is true when we
• 33:19think about addressing racism
• 33:20and other forms of oppression as
• 33:23opposed to being immobilized by
• 33:26the fear of imperfection.
• 33:28To acknowledge we're going to be
• 33:30imperfect and we want to grow from it,
• 33:32right?
• 33:34The bystander effect,
• 33:35where many people in the field
• 33:37will leave the full weight of
• 33:40this responsibility on the staff
• 33:42and faculty of color.
• 33:43So they can have invisible
• 33:45labor where it is on
• 33:48them to address these issues and
• 33:50no one else is taking their part
• 33:54instead of recognizing that this
• 33:56is a collective issue and it
• 34:00requires A collective effort and
• 34:03prioritization for us to shift the tide.
• 34:06Fragility is another one.
• 34:07So a couple of years ago you may
• 34:10have known one of the number one
• 34:12books on Amazon was a book called
• 34:14White Fragility and some people get
• 34:17offended just even by the title.
• 34:19But it is important when we
• 34:22think about fragility,
• 34:23it is this idea that one I cannot
• 34:26hear other people's emotional pain.
• 34:29So when people are sharing their distress,
• 34:32if I say.
• 34:33I don't feel emotionally
• 34:35safe hearing their distress.
• 34:37So now all of the attention
• 34:39needs to come to me,
• 34:40and the people who were expressing
• 34:42their pain need to now take care of me.
• 34:44That is other fragility people
• 34:47are talking about.
• 34:48So you have to have the capacity
• 34:50to not be the center right,
• 34:52to not require to be the center
• 34:55of attention and to be able to be
• 34:58supportive and bear witness and to
• 35:00lean in because it is an honor.
• 35:03When our clients or our colleagues are
• 35:06willing to share with us their experience,
• 35:09we also want to be careful
• 35:11about performative allyship.
• 35:12And many people have confessed that.
• 35:15They said what they thought
• 35:16other people needed to hear,
• 35:17even though they didn't believe it,
• 35:19they were afraid of the consequences
• 35:21that they didn't say it.
• 35:22And I will say the only path to
• 35:25liberation is truth telling,
• 35:27and so we are not looking for
• 35:30people to pretend.
• 35:31We are looking for authenticity
• 35:32and then we can know where do
• 35:35we go from there once we know
• 35:37what's actually in the room.
• 35:39We also want to be careful
• 35:42about people idealizing,
• 35:43which is another form of
• 35:45dehumanizing people of color.
• 35:47So a response that I often get
• 35:50will be things like Tayma.
• 35:51I just love black women,
• 35:53you all our goddesses.
• 35:55Well, a goddess can't be tired.
• 35:59A goddess can't be overwhelmed, right?
• 36:01A goddess and and there's
• 36:04no room for imperfection.
• 36:05So while we can appreciate each other,
• 36:08we want to make sure that we see
• 36:11people in their full humanity and and
• 36:15and that is what is most honorable.
• 36:18Another piece is when we say that
• 36:21talking about racism is divisive.
• 36:24Yeah,
• 36:24I think you all know last year
• 36:25the word of the year,
• 36:26I think by Webster's was gaslighting, right?
• 36:29And I want to say what a form of
• 36:32gaslighting it is for racism to
• 36:35be pervasive and then to claim
• 36:38that people who talk about it
• 36:40are the ones creating division.
• 36:43Like that's masterful.
• 36:44I mean like whoever came up
• 36:45with that strategy,
• 36:47that's really something else, right?
• 36:49So I am harming you.
• 36:51And if you name that I'm harming you,
• 36:54you are the problem.
• 36:57So we want to shift out of that.
• 37:00When I was a graduate student and I
• 37:03was working on my master's thesis,
• 37:05I had one paragraph in my draft
• 37:07of of my article that was talking
• 37:10about racism and sexism in their
• 37:12role in racial and gender identity,
• 37:14their effect on racial and gender identity,
• 37:17and my advisor at the time.
• 37:19Who is a very well respected researcher,
• 37:25white male, said to me, Tayma,
• 37:28And he really was trying to be helpful.
• 37:30He said to me, Tayma,
• 37:32you can leave that paragraph in there
• 37:35or you could take the High Road and
• 37:37take that out and get published.
• 37:39I want you to hear the ways in which
• 37:44we can collaborate and even mentor.
• 37:48People out of truth and not
• 37:52Createspace for it.
• 37:54So we also want to be mindful that we
• 37:58should not try to dictate how people
• 38:01of color feel or how they respond to
• 38:04inequity and to racism and you know it.
• 38:09We wouldn't do that with any
• 38:11other form of trauma, right?
• 38:13We wouldn't say to a survivor. Of war.
• 38:18Of partner abuse. Of molestation.
• 38:21You shouldn't feel like that.
• 38:23You should feel like this,
• 38:24or you shouldn't express yourself
• 38:25in this way, or you should not
• 38:28think about justice in this way.
• 38:30So we want to show up with each
• 38:33other with cultural humility,
• 38:35with courage,
• 38:36and with consistency.
• 38:37This can't be a passing fad.
• 38:40It is a commitment to the ways
• 38:43in which we will live and work.
• 38:46So in African psychology,
• 38:47an important notion is not just focusing
• 38:50on people's labor or productivity,
• 38:53but on their being.
• 38:54And a lot of times in our field,
• 38:56we focus a lot on functioning,
• 38:58and we translate functioning
• 39:00to school and work.
• 39:02But it is important that we tune into
• 39:05people's being and that we also not
• 39:08stop our work with looking at the
• 39:11cessation of symptoms of distress.
• 39:14Because someone may no longer be
• 39:16suicidal but have no joy, right?
• 39:18It's not just about symptom cessation.
• 39:20They may no longer be cutting but
• 39:22not have a sense of purpose or
• 39:25sense of clarity about themselves.
• 39:27So we want to look at those other
• 39:29principles that some referred
• 39:31to as positive psychology,
• 39:33as community psychology,
• 39:35as post traumatic growth,
• 39:37so from a liberation standpoint.
• 39:40To practice a liberation oriented
• 39:43care is to contextualize your care,
• 39:46as also when we think about
• 39:48decolonizing psychology,
• 39:49many times psychology is focused on
• 39:52the individual and overlooking the
• 39:55systems that affect the individual's
• 39:57lives of multiple systems.
• 39:59And so if you have a girl client
• 40:03with an eating disorder and do
• 40:05you only look at it in terms of
• 40:07her having cognitive distortions?
• 40:10And maybe you look at the
• 40:11dieting practices of our mother,
• 40:13but you have not looked at the
• 40:15ways in which girls and women are
• 40:18bombarded with messages about
• 40:20their bodies and about control
• 40:23and about attractiveness.
• 40:25In the media and dating circles,
• 40:28if you are not looking at that
• 40:30larger picture and you're putting
• 40:32that full weight on this 13 year
• 40:34old that for some reason you
• 40:36have a cognitive distortion,
• 40:38right? And we're not going to look
• 40:40at what are the things that gave
• 40:42you those thoughts about yourself,
• 40:44then we are missing it. Right.
• 40:46So from a liberation standpoint,
• 40:49we say not only do we want to consider
• 40:51what we are trying to dismantle or disrupt,
• 40:54which is racism and other
• 40:56forms of oppression,
• 40:57but for us to imagine what is it that we
• 41:00are trying to build or cocreate, right?
• 41:03What would it look like for this family
• 41:05to live in a liberated state of being?
• 41:08What would it look like for this child to
• 41:10have a sense of freedom within themselves,
• 41:13within their bodies,
• 41:14within their minds and culturally
• 41:16about who they are?
• 41:17So it is actively anti oppression,
• 41:20it is holistic and many of our
• 41:22interventions leave out the body.
• 41:24And I am so excited about the advances
• 41:26that are being made around embodied care,
• 41:29trauma, informed yoga.
• 41:31That awareness also about where
• 41:33we hold stress in our bodies.
• 41:36And the ways we can shift our nervous
• 41:39system with regulation and coregulation,
• 41:42these are all very important.
• 41:45So liberation psychology originated
• 41:47out of Latin America and it is
• 41:51really a place of empowering.
• 41:53A big distinction is not stopping at
• 41:56the point of coping strategies but
• 41:58also looking at resistance strategies.
• 42:01So it's not enough to have a
• 42:03child who is faced racism.
• 42:05And simply tell them you know,
• 42:08to journal color and take deep breaths.
• 42:10Those are good coping strategies.
• 42:12But then we have a responsibility
• 42:14to also look at what you may think
• 42:17more of as problem solving coping,
• 42:19not just emotional focus coping.
• 42:21So the problem solving coping or the
• 42:24resistance strategies are what are
• 42:26possibilities that this family may
• 42:28want to do to follow as a result
• 42:31of the housing discrimination or
• 42:32the discrimination that happened in
• 42:34their classroom or in their school.
• 42:37And so this is a big distinction
• 42:40between traditional models of trauma
• 42:43recovery and liberation oriented care.
• 42:46For trauma recovery you also want
• 42:49to attend to intersectionality.
• 42:51And so racism shows up in different ways
• 42:54based on other aspects of your identity.
• 42:57Your sexuality, your gender,
• 43:00your socioeconomic status, your age.
• 43:02All of those affect the ways in
• 43:04which people respond to you.
• 43:06So in our assessment,
• 43:07we want to just ask not what
• 43:09is wrong with this child,
• 43:11what is wrong with this family.
• 43:13We want to think about what
• 43:14has happened to them,
• 43:15not only individually and as a family,
• 43:17but as a community.
• 43:19What are the violations that this community
• 43:22that this cultural group has experienced?
• 43:25And so when you are doing your trauma
• 43:28history intake to be willing to ask
• 43:32questions about microaggressions,
• 43:34discrimination, stereotypes, colorism,
• 43:37racially motivated bullying and harassment,
• 43:42police brutality,
• 43:43vicarious racial trauma,
• 43:46intergenerational trauma?
• 43:47When we look at your case,
• 43:49conceptualization and your treatment plan,
• 43:53if you have erased this person's identity,
• 43:58then you are not providing ethical care.
• 44:01By our ethics guidelines,
• 44:03we have to attend to who is in
• 44:06the room in their fullness.
• 44:07And so your assessment is going
• 44:10to dictate your conceptualization,
• 44:12which is going to dictate
• 44:13your treatment plan.
• 44:14So if I never ask about racism.
• 44:18And then it is not likely to be
• 44:20addressed and it sets the tone for us
• 44:23to engage in anti racism therapy for
• 44:25us to be able to frame it by saying,
• 44:28as we frame the trauma assessment that
• 44:31many people have experienced racism.
• 44:34And I'm aware that that can really
• 44:36have an effect on people's mental
• 44:38health or I'm aware that they can
• 44:40really have an effect on your feelings,
• 44:42your thoughts, your actions.
• 44:43And I wonder if you can share with
• 44:46me if that has been a part of your
• 44:48experience and how you have coped with that.
• 44:53I have a healing racial trauma
• 44:55model and there are other models.
• 44:57This is important to share because when
• 44:59we started doing this work or asking to,
• 45:02we've been asked to share more.
• 45:04After Black Lives Matter.
• 45:05When I share often in the Q&A
• 45:08people will say things like it
• 45:10sounds like you all need a theory.
• 45:12There are many theories.
• 45:13There are many theories,
• 45:14so you just were not often
• 45:17exposed to them in your training.
• 45:20So we look at these themes based
• 45:24approaches to acknowledge racism to get
• 45:26to the place of us being able to share
• 45:30from that narrative therapy perspective,
• 45:32working on healing trust.
• 45:34Not only how do I discern who is trustworthy?
• 45:38In the environment around me,
• 45:41but also building trust within myself,
• 45:44reconnecting with myself and
• 45:47addressing internalized racism.
• 45:49Internalized racism is when you
• 45:51come to believe the lies you
• 45:53have been told about yourself.
• 45:55So if you are a black child who believes
• 45:58that black people are not as smart.
• 46:01If you are a Latina who believes
• 46:04that Latinas are not as attractive
• 46:06as non Latino white girls,
• 46:08then this is the internalization
• 46:11that requires healing.
• 46:13If you are Asian American and
• 46:16have experienced the colorism and
• 46:18believe that you would be better
• 46:20if you have been born lighter.
• 46:23So this is the the the work that we
• 46:25need to do Not only the external work
• 46:28with how do I navigate these systems,
• 46:30but also how do I come home
• 46:33to myself and heal myself.
• 46:35We need to have space for
• 46:36people to grieve the losses,
• 46:38and this is includes for
• 46:40the parents or grandparents.
• 46:41What were the things that
• 46:43racism took from them?
• 46:44Some of them had dreams that were not
• 46:46realized and the blockage was not a matter
• 46:49of them not being willing to work hard.
• 46:51But the realities of discrimination,
• 46:54xenophobia and racism.
• 46:57We have to have places where people can
• 46:59talk about their anger and their outrage.
• 47:02We do want to give the coping strategies of
• 47:05what are ways that we can soothe ourselves,
• 47:08but then also the resistance
• 47:10strategies as well.
• 47:12We want to integrate
• 47:14indigenous ways of healing,
• 47:16So it is.
• 47:18Not by accident that we often
• 47:22utilize the expressive arts.
• 47:24It is not by accident that
• 47:25we have discovered the gift,
• 47:27the healing gift of storytelling.
• 47:29These are culturally rich traditions
• 47:31that often are not acknowledged in
• 47:33terms of where we got them from.
• 47:35We act like we discovered and we gave
• 47:37it a name and say like if you're
• 47:39healing strategy started in the 1980s,
• 47:41I encourage you to dig a little deeper.
• 47:44That there are communities that were
• 47:47using those strategies long before
• 47:49that there are a number of healing
• 47:51racial trauma models to look at.
• 47:53The Association of Black Psychologists
• 47:55has emotional emancipation
• 47:57circles which are community based,
• 47:59drop in groups.
• 48:00Soulfulness is some incredible
• 48:03culturally contextualized work
• 48:04similar to mindfulness but
• 48:06with culture at the forefront.
• 48:08Done by Shelley Harrell.
• 48:11Ubuntu Optimal Psychology Yoga for Healing
• 48:15Racial Trauma Testimonials is an
• 48:18aspect of liberation psychology
• 48:20which is that narrative piece of
• 48:22how do people tell their stories?
• 48:25And for those of you who use many of
• 48:28these mainstream models to look at,
• 48:30how do I apply them to racism?
• 48:33So there is work on EMDR applied with racism,
• 48:37cognitive processing,
• 48:38mindfulness based therapy,
• 48:40psychodynamic and humanistic
• 48:42approaches as well.
• 48:44So I am grateful that you're willing or
• 48:47some of you may be willing to do this work.
• 48:49I'm going to say because you showed up,
• 48:51although some people may have
• 48:52just shown up out of curiosity.
• 48:54But I am hopeful that you are willing to
• 48:57be a part of the solution and I believe
• 48:59we can shift the tide in some beautiful ways.
• 49:02And so I want to just say to you,
• 49:05it is not just about cultural competence,
• 49:08It is about being actively
• 49:10engaged in anti oppression work.
• 49:13This is not a Sprint,
• 49:15it's a marathon.
• 49:16And I hope you will join me.
• 49:19I'm ready to take your questions
• 49:20and I'll just put these two
• 49:22resources up on the screen.
• 49:24Thank you so much.
• 49:34Thank you so much, Doctor Bryant and Karen,
• 49:37I wasn't sure if there's anything
• 49:39you wanted to add before we jump in.
• 49:42If folks want to collect their
• 49:44thoughts and share any questions
• 49:46that they have for Doctor Bryant,
• 49:53you asked me if I have anything else?
• 49:56No, we were checking on Karen.
• 49:58Whether he had anything that he
• 50:00needed to say for housekeeping things
• 50:01before we open it up to questions.
• 50:04No, we're we're all good.
• 50:05I'm here in the Cohen.
• 50:07Excellent. All right, well,
• 50:09if folks, do you have questions,
• 50:11feel free to drop them in the chat
• 50:16or. Oh, I see some hands.
• 50:21Sajad, you want to go ahead?
• 50:26Sure,
• 50:30right. Hello. Thank you,
• 50:31Doctor Brian for such an incredible
• 50:34and amazing presentation.
• 50:36I'm also a psychology fellow and
• 50:37actually in the trauma track.
• 50:39So this is a huge, you know,
• 50:41interest of mine and I love to learn
• 50:43about different ways we can conceptualize
• 50:45and work with trauma and of course.
• 50:48The trauma lens and different theories.
• 50:50I was diligently taking notes as you were
• 50:53presenting one of the questions that I had.
• 50:55So you know, the child Study center,
• 50:57a lot of times we have a
• 50:59lot of sessions where,
• 51:00you know, with all kid work,
• 51:01we're meeting with parents and caregivers,
• 51:02we're meeting with kids.
• 51:04And you know, sometimes they have differing
• 51:06views of racism or their experiences.
• 51:09So just kind of was wondering,
• 51:12you know,
• 51:12how best to navigate those discrepancies
• 51:14if they are in terms of conceptualization,
• 51:17how we communicate with the
• 51:19families and children,
• 51:20even intervention,
• 51:21I was just kind of wondering about that.
• 51:29I'm sorry, I was cutting in and out.
• 51:31So you were asking,
• 51:33the families have different views
• 51:34and how do we address that?
• 51:36They have different views.
• 51:38Yeah. Stuff like the parents
• 51:39experiences are different than,
• 51:41you know, the child or the adolescent
• 51:44in terms of racism or just their
• 51:46experiences of it here. Yes,
• 51:49Beautiful. This is so important for
• 51:53us to invite parents or grandparents.
• 51:56Whoever are the key family members who
• 52:00are attending, if they are willing
• 52:02to share a part of their story and
• 52:05what their experiences have been,
• 52:07there is a wealth of wisdom there, and
• 52:10sometimes those stories have not been shared.
• 52:14And for some parents it is that it's painful
• 52:18and they don't want to think about it.
• 52:21For some, it is this idea that.
• 52:26They don't want to burden their
• 52:29children with those realities,
• 52:31but it can be helpful for us to
• 52:35share that from our experience.
• 52:37And you know, from our research,
• 52:40we know that it can be a gift and that
• 52:43children can be empowered when they learn
• 52:47about how we survived what we survived.
• 52:51And if they want to start with instead
• 52:54of the experiences of the racism,
• 52:57more so about the cultural
• 52:59richness and heritage.
• 53:01Because I think when we talk
• 53:03about intergenerational conflict,
• 53:05especially among families where there's
• 53:07a more recent immigration history,
• 53:10then sometimes the the kids association
• 53:12can be this is the like a culture of rules
• 53:16or it's all the things I can't do but they.
• 53:20Have not always received
• 53:22like the gift of it right,
• 53:23the beauty of it and so encouraging
• 53:26that storytelling is important and also
• 53:29to encourage the children to share,
• 53:31because if the ways in which
• 53:34racism shows up now,
• 53:36some of it is consistent over time.
• 53:39And some of it is some new ways.
• 53:40When we think about,
• 53:41for example,
• 53:41cyberbullying and racism online,
• 53:43these are pieces that many of
• 53:46the the parents or other family
• 53:48members may not be tuned into.
• 53:57Thank you for that really
• 53:59thoughtful response.
• 54:01Do other folks have questions?
• 54:02I'm pretty sure we have
• 54:03time for at least one.
• 54:04Oh good, we've got Tara here.
• 54:11Go ahead. Yeah. Perfect.
• 54:14Well, Doctor Bryant, thank you.
• 54:16I just need to say,
• 54:17I saw you talk at Smith College many,
• 54:20many summers ago, and you walked in
• 54:23and you started your talk with song.
• 54:26And you stood with me all these years,
• 54:29so I was so glad to see
• 54:31that you did that again.
• 54:33So just a little note,
• 54:34because it was really nice,
• 54:35like still singing. Yeah.
• 54:37But it was really nice to just
• 54:39see someone start an academic
• 54:41conversation as a complete human.
• 54:42So I really appreciated that.
• 54:46Additionally I I just your talk,
• 54:49thank you so much and it was so
• 54:51validating because we're doing,
• 54:53we do a lot of evidence based treatment
• 54:55here and there's a lot of conversation
• 54:58about how you have to adjust.
• 55:02In how you deliver this,
• 55:03these evidence based treatments to
• 55:05make room for the storytelling,
• 55:07to make room for the fact that
• 55:08this could be the first time that
• 55:10an individual has ever felt like
• 55:12they could share their story,
• 55:13or even given space or permission to do so,
• 55:17and the importance of shifting
• 55:19away from the number of sessions.
• 55:22But instead to the clinical goals of
• 55:25the session and ensuring that you're
• 55:28making the cultural and racially
• 55:31and linguistically appropriate
• 55:33adjustments to allow an entire human
• 55:36beings experience into the room
• 55:38in a way that resonates for them.
• 55:40And that isn't about the way we
• 55:42believe the treatment needs to be.
• 55:45Yes, absolutely. I want to thank
• 55:47you for saying that because it also
• 55:49triggered a very important not a
• 55:52negatively trigger reminded me of a
• 55:54very important thing I want to say.
• 55:56If you are going to elicit information,
• 56:00you have to 1st identify where you stand,
• 56:05because if I don't know you.
• 56:09To be a trustworthy person
• 56:10as it relates to racism,
• 56:12I might think you're very trustworthy if you
• 56:14want to talk about physical child abuse.
• 56:16But if I'm not clear of how
• 56:19you think about it,
• 56:20it is not going to be safe for me to share.
• 56:23And my mother was in a
• 56:26group for senior women,
• 56:29older women and the facilitators.
• 56:31They were all black women as it as it was
• 56:35the facilitator was a young white woman.
• 56:38Who said, you know,
• 56:39there's been a lot happening in the news.
• 56:41Like, how do you guys feel about that?
• 56:43And my mom just said, like,
• 56:44the group just went silent because, you know,
• 56:48they don't know how you think about it.
• 56:52So you're trying to, like,
• 56:52extract information from me, but like,
• 56:55where do you stand before you ask
• 56:58me to share what I think about it?
• 57:00So you want to be mindful of that
• 57:03in in in any form of oppression
• 57:06and in particular when you don't
• 57:09have the same identity.
• 57:11And I saw one last thing in the chat and
• 57:15then I do have to jump off for another zoom.
• 57:18My apologies,
• 57:18but it I think,
• 57:20was asking about indigenous
• 57:22approaches and it is very important
• 57:25to recognize the distinction between.
• 57:28Acknowledgement and appropriation, right.
• 57:31So if there is a culturally specific
• 57:36ritual that you are not trained
• 57:41or empowered to do,
• 57:43it's not for you to facilitate that.
• 57:45I had a Native American client who.
• 57:48Talked about how her therapist tried
• 57:50to start with having them stand
• 57:51and acknowledge the four wins and
• 57:53she was looking at this therapist
• 57:55like who are you like and who gave
• 57:57you the right to do that.
• 57:58So you know the way to to enter it is when
• 58:02we think about solutions focused therapy.
• 58:05So asking people when you were doing
• 58:07your best or feeling your most nourished
• 58:09in general and then as it relates
• 58:11to your culture what were practices
• 58:13or things that you were doing.
• 58:16And sometimes when we're stressed
• 58:18and traumatized,
• 58:19we have like let go of those things.
• 58:21So it may be, oh, you know,
• 58:23I used to do this. I used to do that.
• 58:25And so as a part of my healing,
• 58:28I want to start doing that again.
• 58:30And then we'll continue to check in to say,
• 58:32okay this week.
• 58:33Were you able to do it or what's
• 58:35the plan to do it?
• 58:37So you want to be thoughtful
• 58:39and careful about that.
• 58:40And thank you all so much for having me.
• 58:43Thank you so much, Doctor Brian and you,
• 58:47I can see that there are many
• 58:49more questions coming up.
• 58:50And so your talk has certainly
• 58:52brought up questions for a
• 58:54continued dialogue for us.
• 58:56Thank you so much for taking the time.
• 58:58And I should say APA has just released
• 59:01a book on Decolonizing psychology.
• 59:04They have a book that came out two
• 59:06years ago on liberation psychology.
• 59:08So you can read more of the
• 59:09theory and the background,
• 59:11but thank you and you all take good care.
• 59:14Wonderful. Thank you so much.
• 59:15Have a good rest of the day everyone,
• 59:16and thank you for joining.